Need Motor Mount Suggestions for Stop/Go Traffic

[Finch204]

I got the old CS Race RMM and GenPu TMM insert on my Juan. Feels solid. Still a slight rock in stop and go but I keep her in 2nd when we are just crawling along. Stock PMM as well.

I've read nothing but positive reviews on the CS Race RMM. Do you have the one with 70A duro or are you using the 80A duro? When you're crawling in 2nd gear, how does the car drive when you're on/off the throttle? It is this transition that tires me out, when getting on the throttle my car would not so smoothly jerk forward. When getting off the throttle, sometimes it is smooth but usually it gets rough when going down to 1500 RPM. So what I've had to do now is to already clutch in before I get to 1500 RPM, which can be tiring if in stop/go traffic for awhile.

The RMM is 90% of the problem in the stock setup. I would replace that first, then down the road, put a Damond TMM in for longevity if nothing else, because the stock TMM bushings can be short lived. Also because it's barley any noisier than stock while holding way better.

That's what I thought, especially after looking at the videos again, where they show the OEM RMM vs Stage 2 RMMs stopping the engine from rocking back and forth.

If minimal nvh is what is wanted change the rear mount to dm and keep stock tmm/pmm mount. That will clean up some of the crap and keep it livable for a dd.

That is a no go as I've already tried the DM RMM and it was a little too much NVH for me.

Sounds like the best solution is to get a cheap but comfy beater/commuter and then get the full Damond package for the Speed when you want to romp on it with absolutely zero torque steer or wheel hop. Such a drastic difference over how the car behaved with stock mounts and stock power.

Having a separate commuter car would be great, but I cannot justify having two cars right now. It is just extra cost/expense that I don't want to have right now. As Chpspd has mentioned, my Speed3 is my daily driver/commuter car. If I cannot make it work with the Speed3, or if I get too tired with the stop/go traffic, the Speed3 will be replaced with a more appropriate comfy commuter car.

 

[Db09ms3]

I have the 80a as that is all they produce for that mount. As for the traffic in 2nd gear, I just let her roll with no throttle input and when I'm ready to go I slowly push the pedal. That's it. The mounts are the main issue, period. Suffer with a good RMM and keep the rest stock.

The mounting of this engine is pretty shitty I noticed. My brother's cobalt and my buddy's gf's honda civic all had 4 fuckin' mounts.

 

[Finch204]

I have the 80a as that is all they produce for that mount. As for the traffic in 2nd gear, I just let her roll with no throttle input and when I'm ready to go I slowly push the pedal. That's it. The mounts are the main issue, period. Suffer with a good RMM and keep the rest stock.

The mounting of this engine is pretty shitty I noticed. My brother's cobalt and my buddy's gf's honda civic all had 4 fuckin' mounts.

Yeah CS used to sell one with a 70A duro option, but they stopped since it wore out over time. So they only sell the 80A option now. Thanks for the input!

 

[SharksInSpace]

I had the CS race rmm and swapped it to CS Stage2. Vibes increased a bit but the engine is so much more planted. The one that made the biggest difference for me was DM pmm, was night and day but my oem mount was also totally blown when i swapped it so ¯\_(?)_/¯

 

[Finch204]

I had the CS race rmm and swapped it to CS Stage2. Vibes increased a bit but the engine is so much more planted. The one that made the biggest difference for me was DM pmm, was night and day but my oem mount was also totally blown when i swapped it so ¯\_(?)_/¯

My stock PMM is still intact at 80k miles. How was the vibes with the CS race rmm?

 

[SharksInSpace]

They were definitely noticeably increased from the race mount but settled from break in (my DM pmm was still fairly new at the time, too). I'm fully mounted now so my impression is kinda skewed. Feeling the vibes themselves doesn't bug me, but the dash rattles sometimes get annoying.

 

[Quigs]

How is buying another car remotely a good solution compared to trying out some mounts. His car is near stock, because he DD's it so much.

With 88 duro jbr rmm, 80 duro tmm, stock pmm and BSD, I didn't think the nvh was that bad in my car until I stopped driving it for a while. When I drove it again after a long hiatus I realized how awful it was.

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Because obviously the Speed is not a very good commuter car for the OP, otherwise this thread wouldn't exist. I can totally understand that annoyance of stop and go traffic with any sort of drivetrain slop. Shit, stop and go traffic sucks in ANY car. But, from what I've seen from the mounts available, no combination of mounts will fix the drivetrain slop without adding some NVH. Unfortunately it's just not going to happen. NVH is extremely subjective and each person has a wildly different expectation of what is too much. Nobody on an internet forum will ever be able to determine what NVH is acceptable to the OP.

I fully encourage the OP to try out mount combinations to see what he likes best, which is where these threads come into play, but at the same time I can understand not wanting to spend the countless dollars and/or hours it could take to find a solution that works. I personally hated my JBR mounts. At the time there was nothing better available and so I compromised because I loved the performance they gave me when it was time to romp on the car...which is why I bought a Speed3 to begin with. I daily drove with those mounts 20k miles a year until I finally decided to switch to Damond after reading rave reviews. Now my car feels almost stock with how quiet and comfortable it is and no passenger has ever even recognized, let alone complained, about any excessive NVH. With that, I have had zero lost in performance and the car gets driven hard every single day. Luckily my commute occurs before anyone else is on the road, so stop and go traffic is hardly a concern for me.

Having a separate commuter car would be great, but I cannot justify having two cars right now. It is just extra cost/expense that I don't want to have right now. As Chpspd has mentioned, my Speed3 is my daily driver/commuter car. If I cannot make it work with the Speed3, or if I get too tired with the stop/go traffic, the Speed3 will be replaced with a more appropriate comfy commuter car.

I can totally understand not being able to have multiple cars, it's certainly not for everyone. But, if you are overly concerned about NVH, then the Speed3 just might not be the best option for you as a commuter. It's not exactly the most quiet car even in stock form anyway, similar with most budget-oriented performance cars. I personally think you really only have three options:

1.) Try some mounts out and see what you like. However, I will warn you that it truly does take some time for the mount to "break in" and the NVH will be worst immediately following install. This happened with both my JBR and Damond mounts. It took a few thousand miles for the vibes to die down. Many people on the forums have reported similar findings. So, if you do want to try out some mounts and see what NVH you are willing to put up with, I just caution you to make sure you really give them a good run before giving up on them.

2.) Compromise with the NVH from mounts regardless if you "like" it or not because you enjoy having a Speed3. (This is what I chose to do)

OR 3.) Sell the Speed3 and get something more comfortable.

Obviously it's all about what you want. If you don't want any NVH at all, then the Speed3 is just probably not a good commuter choice for you. I don't say any of this trying to piss anyone off or anything like that. I totally respect not wanting a commuter to be noisy and have unnecessary vibrations. But at the same time, NVH is just kind of a quirk these cars have unless you want to live with the drivetrain slop. For me personally the compromise was easy. My Speed is totally comfortable IMO and having a DD with 350+ hp that I am still comfortable enough in to take across country is worth it on every level. Plus, with companies like Damond improving on the old designs of JBR for less NVH and the same performance, we have it better than some other cars. My Miata, for example, has similar stiff, small bushing motor mounts and dear god I would hate the drive that thing every day it rattles so bad. I consider myself lucky that we have some options in the Speed3 world that make the NVH totally bearable.

Sorry for the long post. I am truly just trying to provide some insight so that you can make an informed decision based on my personal experiences.

 

[5doorsoffury]

I daily drove my speed np. Jbr rmm and all. It was all highway miles with very minimal traffic.
Then i got a job in brooklyn and the commute turned into 2 hour creap fest for 37 miles. It was not the NHV that got to me. It was a stick in traffic...
A rmm will make it more solid. It will increase NHV. If thats to much for you get the efocus mount.

It sounds like op is whining about sticking and clutching in traffic and not about his speed. I got a 1000$ 05 sentra auto 80k miles with 50 bucks a month for insurance. Then all of a sudden i stopped careing about NHV on the speed and stopped racking miles as well.

 

[ToyCop]

The Damond RMM is one of the noisier ones despite its incredible holding power and ability to hold up to abuse. The CP-E Stage 2 is much, much easier on the ears, but in my experience, it's also one of the sloppier mounts (can feel when shifting) and mine only lasted 7k miles before the bushing tore due to the fact that they use a soft bushing. I would try the efocus mount before trying the CP-E given the considerable price difference. As I recall the e-focus mount was actually pretty highly regarded on MSF back in the old days for a standard DD replacement. You could also try the CS Stage 2. I think that design looks pretty clever honestly and there's a small chance it's got less NVH than the Damond.

The bushing on my CPE S2 is a little torn as well. I already have the Damond TMM and PMM. I think I might switch to the Damond RMM. Is CPE replacing mounts with torn bushings?

 

[VTMongoose]

The bushing on my CPE S2 is a little torn as well. I already have the Damond TMM and PMM. I think I might switch to the Damond RMM. Is CPE replacing mounts with torn bushings?

They will replace it under warranty for free. I did so on mine, then immediately sold it.

 

[dom]

I don't know if it is installer error or what, but my DM RMM has a weird spot where it it literally shakes the whole car on decel. It only happens on decel. That's the only issue for me.

 

[VTMongoose]

I don't know if it is installer error or what, but my DM RMM has a weird spot where it it literally shakes the whole car on decel. It only happens on decel. That's the only issue for me.

My pu did that, too. Dunno why. My juan doesn't. Either that or the whole car shakes so much from the BSD that it doesn't seem as noticeable.

 

[Mauro_Penguin]

This was discussed in MSF ages ago. It's the nature of our engine. I think between 2800-3400 rpm's it vibrates while downshifting or coasting but not so much on acceleration. The gearheads back in the day figured it out, but I don't remember why. Nothing to worry about though. I think it was less of an issue on built engines with better balanced internals.

 

[Omega]

I know the CS RMM on my MS6 is the tits - I've rode in cars with other mounts or stock blown RMM's and holy shit the vibes are bad. My other mounts are completely stock and I have very little slop even with the low end torque E85 provides. The only PMM to consider is DM - best design period for mitigating terrible NVH. TMM's usually don't matter too much unless they're shot (unlikely issue).

 

[Easter Bunny]

it has to do with being an inline 4 cylinder, there is a harmonic resonance in that rpm range. the shitty motor mount layout makes it difficult to control the motor without amplifying the vibrations. weirdly my pu only does it sometimes on decell and a quick blip of the throttle will make it stop.

I am using the revised washer setup on the damond motor mount. next time i am under the car i will be going back to the original config.

 

[Finch204]

Because obviously the Speed is not a very good commuter car for the OP, otherwise this thread wouldn't exist. I can totally understand that annoyance of stop and go traffic with any sort of drivetrain slop. Shit, stop and go traffic sucks in ANY car. But, from what I've seen from the mounts available, no combination of mounts will fix the drivetrain slop without adding some NVH. Unfortunately it's just not going to happen. NVH is extremely subjective and each person has a wildly different expectation of what is too much. Nobody on an internet forum will ever be able to determine what NVH is acceptable to the OP.

I fully encourage the OP to try out mount combinations to see what he likes best, which is where these threads come into play, but at the same time I can understand not wanting to spend the countless dollars and/or hours it could take to find a solution that works. I personally hated my JBR mounts. At the time there was nothing better available and so I compromised because I loved the performance they gave me when it was time to romp on the car...which is why I bought a Speed3 to begin with. I daily drove with those mounts 20k miles a year until I finally decided to switch to Damond after reading rave reviews. Now my car feels almost stock with how quiet and comfortable it is and no passenger has ever even recognized, let alone complained, about any excessive NVH. With that, I have had zero lost in performance and the car gets driven hard every single day. Luckily my commute occurs before anyone else is on the road, so stop and go traffic is hardly a concern for me.

I can totally understand not being able to have multiple cars, it's certainly not for everyone. But, if you are overly concerned about NVH, then the Speed3 just might not be the best option for you as a commuter. It's not exactly the most quiet car even in stock form anyway, similar with most budget-oriented performance cars. I personally think you really only have three options:

1.) Try some mounts out and see what you like. However, I will warn you that it truly does take some time for the mount to "break in" and the NVH will be worst immediately following install. This happened with both my JBR and Damond mounts. It took a few thousand miles for the vibes to die down. Many people on the forums have reported similar findings. So, if you do want to try out some mounts and see what NVH you are willing to put up with, I just caution you to make sure you really give them a good run before giving up on them.

2.) Compromise with the NVH from mounts regardless if you "like" it or not because you enjoy having a Speed3. (This is what I chose to do)

OR 3.) Sell the Speed3 and get something more comfortable.

Obviously it's all about what you want. If you don't want any NVH at all, then the Speed3 is just probably not a good commuter choice for you. I don't say any of this trying to piss anyone off or anything like that. I totally respect not wanting a commuter to be noisy and have unnecessary vibrations. But at the same time, NVH is just kind of a quirk these cars have unless you want to live with the drivetrain slop. For me personally the compromise was easy. My Speed is totally comfortable IMO and having a DD with 350+ hp that I am still comfortable enough in to take across country is worth it on every level. Plus, with companies like Damond improving on the old designs of JBR for less NVH and the same performance, we have it better than some other cars. My Miata, for example, has similar stiff, small bushing motor mounts and dear god I would hate the drive that thing every day it rattles so bad. I consider myself lucky that we have some options in the Speed3 world that make the NVH totally bearable.

Sorry for the long post. I am truly just trying to provide some insight so that you can make an informed decision based on my personal experiences.

Appreciate the input. When I bought my 2013 Speed3 5 years ago, it was a perfectly acceptable commuter car for the commute I had. 60/40 highway/city driving with minimal stop and go. Most of the miles on my car were highway miles. The car has done a number of road trips already. It was great. Fast forward to today and my commute has turned bad with "almost" unavoidable stop and go traffic. I have no qualms about trading in the Speed3 for something more comfy, but would obviously like to keep it if possible.

I daily drove my speed np. Jbr rmm and all. It was all highway miles with very minimal traffic.
Then i got a job in brooklyn and the commute turned into 2 hour creap fest for 37 miles. It was not the NHV that got to me. It was a stick in traffic...
A rmm will make it more solid. It will increase NHV. If thats to much for you get the efocus mount.

It sounds like op is whining about sticking and clutching in traffic and not about his speed. I got a 1000$ 05 sentra auto 80k miles with 50 bucks a month for insurance. Then all of a sudden i stopped careing about NHV on the speed and stopped racking miles as well.

I honestly don't think it is the shifts that bother me, but the drivetrain slop when engine braking during decel, particularly when it gets close to 1500 RPM. The constant bobbing of my head forward and back, that's what I wanted to get rid of. I do agree though that driving a car with auto trans would resolve my problems, but I do not have that option now and I was hoping to not have to get one just for commuting. I didn't think that I was whining, but I suppose that's how it looks like. I'm just looking for a smoother driving experience.

I don't know if it is installer error or what, but my DM RMM has a weird spot where it it literally shakes the whole car on decel. It only happens on decel. That's the only issue for me.

I had that same issue too when I had my DM RMM. I had some vibrations during deceleration from around 3000-2700 RPM. I could cancel it out by lightly tapping on the gas as someone else has noted. This was prevalent in my car because the speed limit in Texas is 70 mph, which puts you right around that RPM range.

------------------
I appreciate everyone's input on this thread. I took awhile to reply on here because I was trying out a new route to try and avoid the stop/go traffic. The new route is slower by like 5-10 minutes and I've traded stop/go traffic for being stopped at a traffic light. I am finding that this is more acceptable though since I don't have to crawl in 2nd gear and so there is less drivetrain slop affecting my drive. It is also cheaper than buying a new RMM. That said, I'm still looking to upgrade my RMM in the future and will most likely go with the CS Race RMM or the e-focus mount.

 

[PadreDave]

So, after some trial and error, I finally settled on: CS Stage 2 for RMM; Sure Motorsports for PMM and stock TMM with the CS insert. I tried the Damond PMM but after lowering it there was just too much NVH for even occasional use. Now, things are really firmed up, as 3 track days have verified, and my NVH is about half of what it was with the DM PMM.

Your mileage may vary

 

[JohnnyTightlips]

So, after some trial and error, I finally settled on: CS Stage 2 for RMM; Sure Motorsports for PMM and stock TMM with the CS insert. I tried the Damond PMM but after lowering it there was just too much NVH for even occasional use. Now, things are really firmed up, as 3 track days have verified, and my NVH is about half of what it was with the DM PMM.

Your mileage may vary

I had thought about replacing the DM PMM bushing with something a little more forgiving since I am 95% DD non hooning. Would be nice for them to offer that. I am not sure if it would help but it would be nice to try.

 

[Littleloogy]

Kind of late to the party...

I am absolutely in love with my CS stage 2 RMM with stock Transmission and passenger Motor mounts. Just the right amount of vibes for DD and still with that racecar feel. I am sure I will change my mind once Once I start putting down some real power, but right now at 300/350 it works well.




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[stockms3]

I have cpe stage 2.... Disappointed to see people having issues with it, because it has been nice so far.

I guess I will try CS stage 2 next. I also need to get a different daily....I'm so dumb for buying a Mazda 3 that's stick for a daily.