Building for the road course...again

First start masked this sound. I primed the ever living shit out of the car so by the time I fired it…it was happy?

i couldn’t get the coolant bled on the initial fire up day so I started the next day.

when I fired the car up it made one hell of a racket. As it warmed up it started purring away like stock. Sounded great.

let it cool off after I got the coolant bled(which I started and stopped the engine like 4 times during the process and it sounded great).

anyways be prepared for the sounds of hell. I’ve asked around on the k20 forums
Annndddd nothing.

keep in mind I’ve changed the oil. It was damn clean. I also pulled the valve cover off. Everything seems in order. Nice and clean. No metal. It’s definitely a top end noise and it sounds like a failed vtc gear. I applied a sort of temp fix to my vtc gear and that didn’t do a damn thing. Same exact noise at cold start. Only happens after the car has been off for 4+ hours.

Chain rattle help!!!!


I don’t even want to fuck around anymore. I’m ready to begin parting out. Make my money back and call it a day
 
L337TurboZ said:
Come on don't give up. I'm sure right now you're pissed off. I know I would be. Is the engine alright? Only a rattle?
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Once it warms up(1-2 minutes of idle) the sound goes away and it actually sounds fantastic.

what’s cause that sound? I have no idea but it sounds like total hell.

i don’t think I have the patience to fuck with it any longer
 
Dude you got this thing together fast. Some of the stuff you did would take others a long time. It's still winter, you have time before the season starts.

Are they solid lifters or hydraulic?

It could be a bad chain tensioner bleeding down oil.

Could be a small hole losing oil pressure that seals when the engine reaches a certain temperature.

Do you have a mechanical oil pressure gauge you can monitor during a cold start? Or any way to check for VTEC cam phaser variation
 
Checking oil pressure on this engine is like a total pain in the ass. The pressure switch is at the back of the block on a dumb place that isn’t visible unless it’s on a lift or unless you pull the valve cover in which case you still can’t see shit. You can feel it’s there though.

i have no idea what the problem could be. Initially I thought bad vtc as it sounds almost identical to vtc rattle. This gear came with the cams, it’s not my gear from my motor. Maybe it’s bad.

the tensioner for the timing chain is new. In-line pro. Supposed to be “the best one”. Chain is also new, oem from Honda.

There wouldn’t be any marks on the valve cover from chain slap as the upper chain guide sits maybe 2-3mm above the chain on the cam side. The chain can’t hit the cover. Not possible.

This engine uses rocker arms that are directly actuated by the cams. It is possible the valve lash could be WAY out but I looked up that sound and it’s not the same.

I’m at a loss here. Maybe one of the vtec pins/springs is missing causing a rocker to knock around. I thought of this but they all feel tight. Also doesn’t explain why it gets quiet after it’s been idling a bit

I need a buddy to watch the valve train as I turn over the crank. Even if I primed the engine with the valve cover off. Just so we could see if anything’s doing weird shit.

I also don’t really want to touch the thing at all anymore.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Have you considered just letting it run and then driving it to break everything in? Maybe after some wear it will stop the noise. If it is smooth after a few minutes of warm up is it really worth worrying about considering you have another engine you're building?
 
The going quiet once warm is the part that makes me think it could be a tiny exhaust leak likely right at the head to manifold junction

Or it's something that is supposed to stop oil from draining back that is leaking and the noise is related to there not being enough oil somewhere on startup .

What if you just never turn the car off?
 
L337TurboZ said:
Have you considered just letting it run and then driving it to break everything in? Maybe after some wear it will stop the noise. If it is smooth after a few minutes of warm up is it really worth worrying about considering you have another engine you're building?
Click to expand...
My biggest concern is causing damage to these cams, my cylinder head, or my valve train. I don’t want to keep sending it until this sound it sorted out
 
Easter Bunny said:
The going quiet once warm is the part that makes me think it could be a tiny exhaust leak likely right at the head to manifold junction

Or it's something that is supposed to stop oil from draining back that is leaking and the noise is related to there not being enough oil somewhere on startup .

What if you just never turn the car off?
Click to expand...
Exhaust leak is maybe possible. I’d have to investigate a little further but yea maybe??

If I never shut the car off all would be well lol.

not sure if I want to drive this thing at all. For all I know maybe vtec would engage and destroy everything. Or maybe I’d get a code and that would point towards what could be going on here
 
The way the sound starts and stops in the video has me thinking its something loose. Pulling the valve cover off would be a relatively easy task and you could get a peek at whats inside, perhaps satisfy your curiosity.
Dont give up. I get the desire to step back. That is a valuable trait, one could end up making things worse if not in the right frame of mind about the ordeal. See what you can find but dont hop on repairing it immediately.
Honestly tho, it sounds like an old Chrysler 2.2 when it rattles...and that was normal!! haha
 
gotovato said:
There wouldn’t be any marks on the valve cover from chain slap as the upper chain guide sits maybe 2-3mm above the chain on the cam side. The chain can’t hit the cover. Not possible.

This engine uses rocker arms that are directly actuated by the cams. It is possible the valve lash could be WAY out but I looked up that sound and it’s not the same.
Click to expand...

Still some value in pulling the VC off and checking stuff out, maybe slowly turn the motor over by hand and check the rockers as you go for excessive slap or other weirdness.
 
Enki said:
Still some value in pulling the VC off and checking stuff out, maybe slowly turn the motor over by hand and check the rockers as you go for excessive slap or other weirdness.
Click to expand...
I pulled the valve cover when I first heard the noise. Initial inspection I didn’t find anything out of the norm. This said, I didn’t exactly fine tooth comb it.

I’m going to get a buddy to come over and turn the crank while I watch everything. Next up I’ll pull the fuel pump fuse and just sit on the starter for a bit watching everything. See if anything shows as obvious
 
SyntheticAtmosphere said:
The way the sound starts and stops in the video has me thinking its something loose. Pulling the valve cover off would be a relatively easy task and you could get a peek at whats inside, perhaps satisfy your curiosity.
Dont give up. I get the desire to step back. That is a valuable trait, one could end up making things worse if not in the right frame of mind about the ordeal. See what you can find but dont hop on repairing it immediately.
Honestly tho, it sounds like an old Chrysler 2.2 when it rattles...and that was normal!! haha
Click to expand...
My main Honda guy is convinced something is either loose, or missing. This is a pretty good theory. It’s definitely possible.

when I pull the valve cover again I’ll take a much better look and see.

this is driving me crazy so I think I need another day or two before I start messing with the thing again
 
One guy over on the k20 forums says I gotta set my valve lash. Says that could be causing this.

I’m waiting on the jam nut tool to arrive then I’ll give it a go. Would be nice if that’s all it was
 
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