White smoke only idling.

[bartun]

Hello guys, first of all, I am David, I am from Spain and I own a Mazda 3 MPS (Mazdaspeed3 Gen1)

I am needing some help. My speed3 gen1 is smoking (I think oil, but maybe water?) through exhaust, i think only is in idle and after 2 minutes of start the car. And AFR is around 14.4/14.5 instead of 14.70 like always (I don't know if it's related. Don't know if burn water or oil can drop the AFR, or O2 sensor is dirty).

• I am running straight pipe since the turbo, but I keep the last small muffler.
• Turbo rebuilt with Melett CHRA 1000km's ago.
• No oil inside turbo intake housing.
• No oil in the recirculatory pipe between the rocker cover and the intake.
• Compression test 180/185/185/182 psi (Made the test 4 hours later of turning off the car)

Maybe turbo needs some back-pressure and straight pipe is working bad?
Maybe defective CHRA and burning oil through turbo seals ?
Maybe PCV is working bad?
Maybe valve stem guides?
Maybe bad head gasket and burning water? (I think this is not possible because compression test results are good)

In the second video, I give it a small push to accelerator, look all the floor splash, and exhaust have a lot of tears, I think it can't be condensation because is not winter, and sometimes the smoke smells bad.
Thank you all

 

[jdab555]

Looks pretty symptomatic of a failing turbo. Try a couple of bandaids (5w40 oil, oil restrictor banjo bolt) to see if that makes a difference, also bump your idle up to ~850-900 rpm. Those are pretty simple and cheap ways to test it.

 

[bartun]

Looks pretty symptomatic of a failing turbo. Try a couple of bandaids (5w40 oil, oil restrictor banjo bolt) to see if that makes a difference, also bump your idle up to ~850-900 rpm. Those are pretty simple and cheap ways to test it.

Thanks for answering!

I am running a few mods and a custom tune, so my actual idle is 900rpm. I thought about use 5w40 but I think that just a patch, just hiding a problem. I can try the banjo bolt too but as I said, brand new Melett CHRA was installed 1000km's ago, so no logic bad turbo seals after 1000km's of soft use of the car, but I bought a second hand BNR S4 v1 with 10.000km's few months ago pending to install.

 

[Easter Bunny]

Stick your finger in the splash in the floor is it water or oil?

 

[bartun]

Stick your finger in the splash in the floor is it water or oil?

Feels like oily, but I don't understand so much, but one mechanic friend saw the video and told me that looks like water condensation with some carbon cinder.

Few people told me probably is the turbo again, doesn't matter if I rebuilt 1000km's ago and used a good brand CHRA like Melett, but some Spanish guys in the car group rebuilt it with the same CHRA and everythings was OK.

 

[bartun]

I think I can buy this head gasket test (coolant comunicating with CO2) maybe to discard the possibly head gasket failure?

 

[Easter Bunny]

Get some of the condensation on a piece of paper and post a pic. Does it clear up if you let the car idle for a while

 

[bartun]

Get some of the condensation on a piece of paper and post a pic. Does it clear up if you let the car idle for a while

My car is in the garage and is far away, I can't do nothing before next Saturday. If I remember I'll do. I don't know what you mean with "Does it clear up if you let the car idle for a while".

Should I buy a leak down test? I bought intake manifold gasket, throttle body gasket, PCV plate gasket and a new PCV. I am gonna remove intake manifold and replace the PCV. With the manifold removed, I would like to check the valves if the stem's are oily/brilliant and discard stem guides. With valve stems discarded, new PCV, and compression test with perfect ressults, It only should be the turbo seals, right?

 

[Easter Bunny]

Does it continue to smoke or does it stop

 

[bartun]

Does it continue to smoke or does it stop

I didn't test more than 5 min idling so I can't know 100% true (I don't have time lately) but I think it stops when oil or engine is hot. Few days ago I use it and after few km's, I left idling with hot engine nearly 5 min and no smoke.

I am discarding head gasket because I think if I had head gasket failure and burning water, compression test would be very very low in some cylinder, so probably options PCV valve, valve stem guides, or turbo.

Next saturday I am gonna install the banjo bolt and test again, let idle it atleast 15-20 min in cold, drive it a few km's and test idle again with hot engine.

 

[Easter Bunny]

If it clears up after driving the car it is condensation and you shouldn't worry about it. Take it on a drive and get it warmed up, park it and let it idle for 5-10 minutes if the smoke doesn't return you don't have a turbo issue

 

[bartun]

If it clears up after driving the car it is condensation and you shouldn't worry about it. Take it on a drive and get it warmed up, park it and let it idle for 5-10 minutes if the smoke doesn't return you don't have a turbo issue

That's what I'll do, If I have time, I will idle in cold 15 min, will drive it, then I will idle in hot 15 min. I will install banjo bolt and repeat the test.

 

[Easter Bunny]

I wouldn't install the banjo bolt. It was later determined that the smoking turbos were mostly related to crankcase pressure. Gen2 helped the issue by moving the nipple on the tip closer to the turbo. The corksport to mimics this location. The banjo bolt is really just a bandaid

 

[bartun]

I wouldn't install the banjo bolt. It was later determined that the smoking turbos were mostly related to crankcase pressure. Gen2 helped the issue by moving the nipple on the tip closer to the turbo. The corksport to mimics this location. The banjo bolt is really just a bandaid

Yeah I think too the problem is related with crankcase pressure. If its about crankcase pressure, it would smoke only in "cold", only in "hot" or in both situations?
As I said, I have pending to install a BNR S4 v1 with an HTP 3.5 Intake (that intake have the TIP recirculation a bit closer to the turbo respect the OEM intake, maybe if I can confirm the problem is that, I can solve installing the BNR and the HTP intake, but I am not sure.

 

[Awafrican]

If you're going to replace the PCV I personally recommend just replacing the whole plate as well with one on the damond motorsport ones, no more plastic stuff to break also an Excellent time for catch can install between the PCV and intake manifold (damond again ftw).

Yes smoking cold vs hot vs always is an important diagnostic tool, I've had my car since new and when it's really cold out OR humid sometimes I get what is so much condensation that people actually told me I was burning out when they saw it. Not the case, I've anicdotally notice it less with a fresh PCV valve

 

[bartun]

If you're going to replace the PCV I personally recommend just replacing the whole plate as well with one on the damond motorsport ones, no more plastic stuff to break also an Excellent time for catch can install between the PCV and intake manifold (damond again ftw).

Yes smoking cold vs hot vs always is an important diagnostic tool, I've had my car since new and when it's really cold out OR humid sometimes I get what is so much condensation that people actually told me I was burning out when they saw it. Not the case, I've anicdotally notice it less with a fresh PCV valve

The problem is I am from Spain, here in Spain not a lot of mods/shops for Mazdaspeeds, we have to buy outside always paying big shipping costs and big custom taxes. I am gonna test in cold and in hot, with OEM turbo oil bolt and with the restrictor bolt, in both situations, cold and hot.

I will keep the stock PCV valve with the stock PCV plate, and I would love to install a universal OCC, but I don't know where to buy the check valve I have to install between the OCC and the intake manifold. I can't find a 3/4" or 5/8" check valve, that works with air/gas, with a very low openning pressure, with good materials to hold high temperature and that can be opened by the vacuum of the intake manifold.

My head is gonna explode, I promise.

 

[Easter Bunny]

Dont install the banjo bolt until you know there is actually a problem with the turbo seals

 

[bartun]

Dont install the banjo bolt until you know there is actually a problem with the turbo seals

And I can't install it to detect if its something related with the turbo seals?

What do you think what @Awafrican said? I have a Cobb Intake and maybe the problem is car doesn't have enought strength to suction the pressure of the rocker cover? Maybe the straight pipe from turbo helps to this happening. I disconnected the hose attached to the intake coming from the rocker cover, I've blown through the hose attached to the rocker valve and was hard to insert air, and when I stopped blown, the air has come out again, is this normal or maybe an obstruction?

PD: Sorry my english, lot of translator on it xD

 

[bartun]

I wouldn't install the banjo bolt. It was later determined that the smoking turbos were mostly related to crankcase pressure. Gen2 helped the issue by moving the nipple on the tip closer to the turbo. The corksport to mimics this location. The banjo bolt is really just a bandaid

I saw in forums that Mazda America recognized the problem was this:

a) The engine oil, lubricating the turbo charger bearing, may be excessive. When the internal
pressure of crankcase is higher than the exhaust pressure during idling, it is possible that the
engine oil may leak into the exhaust side of the turbine. The engine oil may be accumulated and
heated inside the exhaust pipe, producing white smoke.
b) The engine oil viscosity is low due to oil dilution with fuel caused by insufficient oil change(s).
c) Low viscosity engine oil is used (lower than 5W-30).

So yeah, maybe this is the problem, plus I am running straight pipe until the last small muffler so I almost have no backpressure in the exhaust. I rode Mazda America was installing the ventilation kit: 3Y1-13-S80B with a better rocker valve, and the recirculation hose coming from the rocker valve, is nearly the turbo.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/OEM-NEW-GE...entilation-Kit-L3Y1-13-S80B-OEM-/191634673408

The answer is, this is only happening with OEM k04? If I install the BNR S4 v1 with HTP 3.5 Intake, will I have this problem? or BNR s4 is bigger and will suction more and problem disappear?
Maybe I have to install stock catback too but keep both catalytic converters uninstalled, this will create backpressure or only catalytic converters create backpressure?

 

[SpeedSensei]

I saw in forums that Mazda America recognized the problem was this:

a) The engine oil, lubricating the turbo charger bearing, may be excessive. When the internal
pressure of crankcase is higher than the exhaust pressure during idling, it is possible that the
engine oil may leak into the exhaust side of the turbine. The engine oil may be accumulated and
heated inside the exhaust pipe, producing white smoke.
b) The engine oil viscosity is low due to oil dilution with fuel caused by insufficient oil change(s).
c) Low viscosity engine oil is used (lower than 5W-30).

So yeah, maybe this is the problem, plus I am running straight pipe until the last small muffler so I almost have no backpressure in the exhaust. I rode Mazda America was installing the ventilation kit: 3Y1-13-S80B with a better rocker valve, and the recirculation hose coming from the rocker valve, is nearly the turbo.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/OEM-NEW-GE...entilation-Kit-L3Y1-13-S80B-OEM-/191634673408

The answer is, this is only happening with OEM k04? If I install the BNR S4 v1 with HTP 3.5 Intake, will I have this problem? or BNR s4 is bigger and will suction more and problem disappear?
Maybe I have to install stock catback too but keep both catalytic converters uninstalled, this will create backpressure or only catalytic converters create backpressure?

I’m having a similar issue as you are currently and i’ve been searching for answers everywhere. I get the same white smoke but it pours out of my exhaust manifold somewhere. What you said about the excessive lubrication on the compressor wheel makes a bit of sense to me as being the issue. But if it were, I’m wondering what would the solution be?